Chad Kultgen — novelist, screenwriter, co-creator of Game of Roses (a.k.a. Bachelor Clues), co-host of Dudesy, and host of YouTube's The Necessary Conversation — joins Podsongs for a 90-minute interview with guest host Robin Dann of the Toronto art-pop band Bernice. Robin is a two-time Polaris Music Prize nominee with Bernice, and on this episode she steps into the host seat to dig into the ideas driving Chad's work: kayfabe, reality TV as sport, AI, and the politics of nihilism.The conversation covers kayfabe in professional wrestling and how the same logic now shapes The Bachelor, reality TV at large, social media, and American politics — including villain edits, engineered viral trends, and the "four audiences" framework from Game of Roses. They discuss the primary world shifting onto screens, what AR, Neuralink-style tech, and AI tools like Suno mean for art, labor, and music, and whether AI music will disrupt songwriting the way AI has disrupted comedy on Dudesy.
Chad opens up about his nihilistic worldview, his position on free will, and how he navigates political conversations with his MAGA-supporting parents on The Necessary Conversation. The episode also gets into his day-to-day creative grind, his musical background and regrets about not studying music formally, his Logic production setup, his obsession with Mormon influencer culture, and the producer mindset he learned from Elon Gale. Robin talks about her own musical roots — jazz studies, Paris, a master's at Goldsmiths — the Toronto scene, Bernice's work in Italy, and her ASMR obsession. The two close by agreeing to collaborate on a song drawn from the interview.
The song that came out of this conversation, "Let's Go Supernova," was written by Robin Dann and is released May 1.
Guests: Chad Kultgen (Bachelor Clues, Game of Roses, Dudesy, The Necessary Conversation) — www.youtube.com/@thenecessaryconversation
Robin Dann (Bernice) — https://bernicemusic.com
Song: "Let's Go Supernova" — written by Robin Dann. Pre-save: https://ffm.to/gosupernova
Podsongs: https://podsongs.com